How do you Challenge your Audience?

Ben: Welcome back to another episode of Content Amplified. Today I'm joined by Jason. Jason, welcome to the show.

Jason Myers: Thanks for having me.

Getting to Know Jason

Ben: Yeah, I'm excited to have you here. Today's going to be a really fun conversation. Very hands on, a little bit different than the normal conversation. But before we dive into that, Jason, let us get to know you. Who are you? What do you love about marketing and content and business in general? Kind of catch us up on to who Jason is and let us get to know you.

Jason Myers: I will try to keep that as a short a story as I possibly can. But I have always loved advertising and marketing even since I was a kid. But I really love today the B2B sales and marketing alignment issues. I think that's where a lot of companies are having issues. I think that on, it really requires a multi -

skill set to be successful or at least have enough collaboration between like sales and marketing thinkers to be successful. And what I mean by that is in the 90s when I started as a marketing director, you know, really our job was positioning, branding and awareness. And so we would place ads and we would do all that kind of stuff. But it was really up to the salesperson to book appointments. And I remember salespeople coming to me saying, I just want them to have heard of us when I go to call them. And so that was kind of my job. And we did sales sheets. The web was fairly new at that point, was basically online brochures. But one of the best things that we ever did in the software world at the time, was custom magazines. So we would put together custom magazines and mail them to our target. So today we call that content marketing. We call it ABM, like we were kind of doing it back then with publishing, where I could control the narrative. And that came out of being frustrated with trying to get listed in trade press and all that kind of stuff, which is very closed group, very difficult to do.

Ben: Yeah.

Jason Myers: And so we would just say, well, forget it. I'm just going to publish my own magazine and mail it to the target audience. And then, that's right. And then in 2005, and if you know anything about the Content Marketing Institute, Joe Pulizzi came from similar background with Penton Publishing and all that. So.

Ben: Yeah. I'll make my own press. Yep.

Jason Myers: But the concept is the same. So the web, really in content marketing, is about developing audiences around content. You're really putting together a media publication and trying to get the interest and add value and publish things that the reader is interested in and not trying to push sales material.

But what was very interesting for me was in about 2005, 2006, I decided that I wanted to start a city business magazine in Austin, Texas. And I found out really fast with a marketing background that I didn't know anything about selling. So I went through Sandler sales training and that turns out that I learned a lot more about how to write copy from sales training than anything that I had learned in marketing previous to that. And really, marketing is, you know, you've got to sell something at some point. I just don't buy into this idea of branding and awareness anymore. Today, you know, a salesperson is going to have a really tough time booking enough appointments if marketing isn't helping them out, you know, and kind of bringing in some qualified leads, not saying that they need to do all the job, but they do need to create some exposure. And the way that you do that, right, is that you write to specific pain points and things that that's going to resonate with the target, which kind of leads us into the conversation today, which is all about you know, how do you do, how do you develop content that actually is going to move somebody off of their status quo because that's the biggest problem is that, well, this is a, you can't be thought of as a, this is a nice to have. We have to, you know, grip somebody by the collar and say, and get them to say, yes, I have that problem. So that they're intrigued into digging into your content more.

Starting the Content Development Process

Ben: I love it. I love it. So when you're looking at this whole system in this process, really trying to get people to engage and change behavior and really look at something new, where do you start when it comes to your content? How do you start to move that motion forward?

Jason Myers: That's a good question. I think you start the process always by talking to customers that you have already and understanding what it is that's going on, or what's the struggling moment that they have that caused them to look for products or services like yours in the first place. Now, if you're just talking to salespeople about that, you'll get some of that. But people buy emotionally and justify rationally. So a lot of times when people reach out to salespeople, they're giving the rational justifications for why they're reaching out. You got to dig and really understand what was the struggling moment in the organization. How does that affect that person directly? If it's a software product and they make a mistake, right? Are they going to lose their job if they pick the wrong thing? That's something we need to know.

Ben: I love that.

Jason Myers: But that's the starting place of all the, of developing your narrative and then carry that through your messaging and, you know, everything to your advertising and your content. I know we've talked about this in the pre -call. I'm a big fan of the Challenger sale, especially the second book in the series, The Challenger Customer, because it talks about, the role of thought leadership. And a lot of companies are making this mistake as I see it. They're doing thought leadership content as they see it. But the content may be interesting to the readers, and it may help develop readership and engagement, which is OK. But it's still kind of the same thing as placing the ads for the salespeople to get branding and awareness or do air cover, so to speak.

Ben: Yep. Yeah.

Jason Myers: If maybe the prospect looks at it and it may be interesting, but it doesn't tell me anything about the person clicking on it to the problems that they may be experiencing in their in their own company. And it doesn't it doesn't give me any reason to consider, you know, whatever product or service you're selling is too tangential. So most companies that need to be efficient today in marketing. So that's really all of them. But some can waste more money than others. But if you really want to be efficient in your content, everything that you develop should be designed on moving somebody off of their status quo. What do I mean by that? You've got to get them to believe that where they are today is not acceptable and worth pursuing a solution.

Ben: Yeah. Yeah.

Jason Myers: And if you're not doing that in your content, it's going to pass right over. So whether it's an ad on LinkedIn, like think of all the ads on LinkedIn, or maybe you can't because we have ad blindness. Like, when's the last ad that stopped you in a feed? Like, as you're scrolling through. Very, very few. I mean, the stopping power required today is enormous.

Ben: It's been a long time, I can't remember. Yeah.

Jason Myers: So if you're not, if you haven't developed a cohesive narrative, the odds that you're going to stop somebody in your tracks is very low. But the reason I like the challenger sale is because it kind of sets up this narrative where the most important thing is to get agreement on a problem worth solving. We talked about this with your site specifically in the pre -call. So your site...

Changing Your Site's Content

Ben: Yeah, and this is fun. Like this is like peeling back the onion. There might be some tears on my part. I love this, but I think this is a fun example for sure. I, you know, we did a pre -call I learned, but you're right beforehand. What it was, was digital asset management and sales enablement in one tool. And one of the first things you said when we got on the call is let's look at your site. Let me prove you what's going on and all of that. But that was, that was the headline when we first talked.

Jason Myers: But, yeah.

Jason Myers: And I see this typically in a lot of sites that I evaluate. And they're descriptive of what they're doing, or at least they're trying to be. Sometimes they use a lot of marketing speak when they're doing that, which is also a mistake. But in your case, you're being descriptive of what it is. It's just not very impactful. And the reason it's not impactful is because you're not tapping into a problem that I potentially have. that must be solved. So now how did you change it?

Ben: We had a fun time. I was exploring this and then also because of this I started reading the Challenger sale and everything and so now the headline is Where is that dot dot dot? Case study blog post white paper YouTube video. It's in mass it that's the new headline going through All the different things that you can store inside of the system and find an access

Jason Myers: Right. And the great thing about that is that you are getting problem agreement, so to speak. So when somebody comes there, they immediately understand, yeah, I can't locate anything in my company. Now, the next question is, is that a problem worth solving? Right. And if it is, and if I'm on your website, it may be. So now all you have to do, so we've attracted the right people. right, that have that problem, that think that it's a problem that's worth solving because I'm researching it. Now all I have to do is point out deficiencies in the way that companies try to solve that problem today. So because I can't locate any of the content, what do companies try to do? They may insert a piece of software. They may put a process in place. You know, who knows? But then it's your job to say that's inadequate. That's not going to work. not going to work very well. And then you provide your reframe, which is how we're solving the problem differently. And by the way, here's why it's proven to be superior over everything in the market. So if you use that format in everything, you're going to go a long way to move people off a status quo and attract people that have the exact problem that you're solving.

Balancing Emotional and Rational Buyer Journeys

Ben: I love that. I love that. Yeah, already I've seen a difference in kind of how we approach and think through things. There's definitely some opportunities that we have. And, you know, this is just a stepping stone for us personally is we're figuring out better ways to, you know, show the problem and the solution and really articulate what our customers say and love. But one thing you said earlier on that I'm really intrigued on and want to double click on the emotional journey and the rational journey. We should play off the blame.

Ben: How do you balance those two? Like you said, people want to buy based off of emotions. They want to have this connection, but then they have to do the rational, you know, logistical justification. How do you balance that in your content and marketing to make sure that you're hitting on both sides of it?

Jason Myers: Yeah, that's a good question. I think you first of all, you have to understand the emotional underlying reasons that somebody buys something in the first place. And that's kind of the starting place. From there, everything else is a facet of that.

Jason Myers: I published a blog a while back called The Lead Generation Mistake I Guarantee You're Making. Now, the one thing I really like about that headline is that there is no question, if you click on that, what your problem is. I pretty much know. But I'm probing. Right, like I'm probing in that one particular piece of content. So somebody might, like on a rational level, say, we need to fix lead generation, or the leads that we're getting in are crappy. We've got to do something about that. But that's a rational justification, right? So when I looked through to see who had clicked on that particular article, I reached out to one CMO. that had clicked on it. And I sent her an email that said, hey, are you in the 40 % or the 60 %? And then the body of the email says, according to HubSpot, 60 % of CMOs think that lead generation is the biggest problem that they must solve. And.

Ben: Yeah.

Jason Myers: She didn't respond to that directly, but she sent it to her DemandGen person who read the article, loved it, and booked an appointment with me immediately.

Ben: Very cool.

Jason Myers: So but tapping into this, like, what happens if we don't fix this? Are you going to be in this category, like of the people that fail? Or you want to be in the ones that succeed? So thinking about, now that's more of an emotional decision, right? Like, I want to be in the ones that succeed.

Ben: Yeah, 100%. I love that. I think that's a great example. I think there's so much to unpack here. Now this is an interesting episode because I feel like we could talk about this for days, but in the spirit of keeping these episodes short and easy to consume for people, we're probably going to have to call it here. But Jason, before we end, if anyone wants to connect and reach out and talk and find you, where and how can they connect with you online?

Jason Myers: Yeah, best thing to do is find me on LinkedIn. Best way to do it because my name is Common Jason Myers. Look for Austin Lawrence Group and then you'll find me that way most easily. And I would like to go a step further. If you're interested in learning about how your specific content is. Working or not working or you'd like me to evaluate any advertising or messaging? from that perspective, you know, definitely connect with me and let's do a content review we do these all the time and they're usually a lot of fun and Learnings on on both ends

Ben: I love it. I love it. Highly recommend anyone interested for sure reach out to lots of good things to impact. I think it'll change your mindset on how to position yourself. So Jason, again, thank you so much for the time and have a good one today.

Jason Myers: Yeah, thanks a lot. I enjoyed it.

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